Rogers delays BYOD price increases for some plans until early February


  • Ken K.

    To all the whiners who will complain about the price increase…just remember these small companies have sharehodlers to feed!

    • Bob Zmuda

      I’m more than willing to feed the shareholders what I flush down the toilet everyday.

    • blueadept1

      Your fiber intake is very healthy.

    • Elton Bello

      You seem jelous

    • beyond

      That’s still too good for them

    • Do Do

      You really are that stupid? The only reason people complain is because of the illegal collusion that’s happening in front of our eyes. If there was real competition prices would be under control and the shareholders would still be making plenty. The big 3 are anti free market scum.

  • One would say it is the telcos fault for these price increases, but they are a business with shareholders — ultimately it is the consumer with the power, if you do not want to pay more, then don’t pay more… Either don’t buy into the service or if you are on an expiring/expired plan, keep it. You really don’t “need” the latest and greatest device. Keep it till it doesn’t work for you, then buy unlocked.
    The consumer has the power, not the business.

    • Me Ted

      Ultimately shareholders are the bane of everyone’s existence. They offer nothing and take everything.

    • Jim__R

      If you are in a company pension plan, then you are arguably an indirect shareholder.
      If you own equity mutual funds or ETFs, then you are a shareholder.
      If you pay into CPP, then you are arguably an indirect shareholder.

      Shareholders are literally everywhere, and they provide at least part of the capital that businesses require to operate. They assume the risk of investing (either directly or indirectly) their money into businesses and for that receive a return on investment. No shareholders means no investments in businesses, and thus in the end, no businesses (or at least no non-state owned businesses).

      The problem is that the Canadian cellular industry is an oligopoly with a high barrier to entry. And, Mobilicity and Wind demonstrated how hard it is to break into that industry.

    • Elton Bello

      Blah blah more propaganda. Having shareholders means companies have no choice but to make short term profits. Nobody benefits from that except shareholders and CEOs who make millions. The country does not benefit long term and certainly not the employees. It is a disaster of a system made for short term profits for the very rich people. For the ordinary people who get involved in that is pure gambling, since they dont have the “backdoor” info the rich companies have when buying and selling. It is a system made of pure greed and Wall Street crises proved that. If nothing changes, things will become worse. So please, go somewhere else with your propaganda.

    • Jim__R

      Please tell me which country you’d like to see modelled after that does not have private businesses and thus no shareholders.

    • Me Ted

      When I see a major corporation fire a swath of employees in the hundreds or thousands because they didn’t “beat the street”, I have no choice but to have the opinion that I do. The sad thing is that company is still profitable, only not profitable enough. It’s a joke and you know it.

    • Jim__R

      What is the alternative system? Can you point to a country that has no private sector (and thus no shareholders) that has a better economy and a higher standard of living than Canada?

    • Me Ted

      Remove public offerings and keep companies private.

    • Jim__R

      Privately held companies still have shareholders. Are you OK with these shareholders?

      At any rate, I can’t think of a single successful country that does not have publicly traded companies. Can you name one?

    • Elton Bello

      Exactly. But seems the greedy rich people were not happy with the millions they had before and wanted billions. So they made the public offerings, which are the doom of working class and countries in long term. And along comes someone like this Jim guy spreading their propaganda. Lol enough is enough.

    • Jim__R

      Name the country that doesn’t have publicly traded companies and is more successful than Canada.

    • Me Ted

      Name the country that doesn’t have the vast majority of its labour force working for privately run companies and is more successful than Canada.

    • Jim__R

      Another transparent attempt to divert from the fact that it’s not possible to point to a real world example of a country that doesn’t have publicly traded companies that is successful.

      Economic systems that have no real world successful examples are not much of an example of anything useful.

    • Elton Bello

      The economic system you are championing and the very aspect of it we are discussing is the very cancer of our society. Was not the Wall Street crises enough for you? What do you say about that?

    • Jim__R

      The Wall Street crisis was caused by a failure to regulate properly. It was not caused by publicly traded companies in and of themselves. The fact that Canada had no such made-in-Canada crisis supports this. Ditto for other developed countries.

    • Elton Bello

      dream on buddy

    • Jim__R

      Hardly a compelling rebuttal.

    • beyond

      In theory Wall Street should work perfectly and efficiently, but in practice humans are irrational and prone to greed, and corruption making proper regulation impossible. The only way to achieve what you are suggesting and avoid all crisis is to rule with an iron fist, and people will just not accept that.

    • Me Ted

      That’s a global system that we’ve been forcibly thrust into at the behest of those who have profited tremendously from it, while playing God with the middle and lower class’ wealth. It’s the “best system” because those infinitely in the minority have done very well by it.

      How can anyone argue that an economic system that allows one large investor (say Warren Buffet) to literally shift entire markets with one trade, is sustainable? That’s a fundamental problem because in the end, the market really isn’t free. It’s controlled and manipulated by a very select few with the financial leverage to destroy economies. This is actually pretty common knowledge and even available in the mainstream media.

    • Elton Bello

      I will give you an example if you tell me which one is the biggest weath fund in the world. Please no googling lol

    • Jim__R

      My answer is: I don’t know.

      Now what’s your answer?

      Or is there no country more successful than Canada that doesn’t have publicly traded companies? All of the G7 have publicly traded countries. The OECD countries all have publicly traded companies. Even China and Russia have publicly traded companies. I suppose North Korea and Cuba don’t, but I wouldn’t want to try to argue they’re more successful than Canada.

      Economic systems that have no real world successful examples are not much of an example of anything useful.

    • Me Ted

      Your problem is somehow you’ve drawn this magic parallel between those countries that are “successful” and those using one simple metric.

      As I said before I could easily say that the measure of a “successful” country is the amount of small-to-mid-size businesses that exist and not larger publicly traded companies. The proof is actually in the pudding when we’re talking about Canada seeing as approximately 70% of the workforce is tied to small-to-mid-size, privately run businesses.

    • Jim__R

      One important, perhaps the most important, metric of a successful country is the standard of living afforded to its citizens. No country without publicly traded companies beats Canada using that important standard.

    • Jim__R

      First off what does “tied to” mean? Either workers work for privately held companies or they don’t.

      And please provide a citation for the assertion that almost 90% of the workforce is tied to privately held companies.

    • Me Ted

      “First off what does “tied to” mean? Either workers work for privately held companies or they don’t.”

      Yes. “Work for”. I didn’t realize there was any ambiguity there. My apologies.

      “And please provide a citation for the assertion that almost 90% of the workforce is tied to privately held companies.”

      That was actually very easy. I simply got the value by calculating the difference between the total number of employed Canadians and those who are employed by publicly traded companies. That remaining number would then represent those people who work in the private sector.

      Here are the calculations and sources (can’t use links on here). I’ll just show the basic formula with the actual numbers plugged in for clarity’s sake:

      Employed total ~= 18m
      – Statistics Canada 2015 Employment and unemployment figures

      Employed by publicly traded companies ~= 3m
      – CSV file grabbing complete sum of the employees column, taken from Globe and Mail article from 2012 – Ranking Canada’s top 1000 public companies by profit

      Employed by private sector ~= Employed total – Employed by publicly traded companies -> 15m

      Now I was actually wrong citing almost 90%. The number is closer to 83%. That’s because I was actually using Canada’s total labour force number of ~=19.2m as opposed to those workers who are actually working ~= 18 (as we all know, the difference between those two numbers represents the unemployment rate in Canada).

    • Mike Wort

      We have ourselves a true Gordon Gecko wannabe here. He Jim, you watch the news ? As the global elite descends on Davos this week, stories of wealth inequality are all over the news. Google it!

      As to other countries. There is a system practiced in Germany called social-market-economy which a bridge between laissez-faire economics and socialism. You *can* have public companies AND social responsibility.

      Sorry mate, but Harper is OoO. But don’t worry, you’ll have a fascist government just south of here pretty soon if Trump gets his way. You can vote to get annexed then and enjoy the free-for-all. Make Canada great again.

    • Jim__R

      Wow, you folks really seem incapable of formulating arguments without resorting to ad hominem attacks and straw men arguments.

      If you had carefully read the thread, you’d see the question is whether a country can be successful without publicly traded companies. That’s the extent of it.

      Obviously, Germany is a country with publicly traded companies, and is thus not a example of a successful country *without* publicly traded companies.

    • Elton Bello


    • Elton Bello

      Its the Norwegian State Oil Company, not a private – state owned company, because oil is national treasure. You care to know what they have done? They have saved and put all the money in separate funds because they know the oil is a finite resource and instead of wasting it on private Co profits, they are investing it and will invest it in the projects of the future for the good of the norwegians. Canada has so much wealth and have wasted it on shady deals.
      If norwegians can do it, why cant Canada do it?

    • Jim__R

      The Statoil s not a country, it’s a company. It is in a country which does indeed have publicly traded companies. It’s success is irrelevant to the actual question of whether there exists a successful country that does not have publicly traded companies.

    • Me Ted

      Define “successful” please.

    • Elton Bello

      Cant argue with a peson who cant see things for what they are. That was not the example of the country but I simply named the largest wealth fund in the world and how they do it. Canada should take example by that and I know there is nothing you can say because you dont seem very knowledgable about the topic. Your propaganda does not work here. Go talk to your Wall Street buddies lol

    • Delphus

      Stallin’s Russia, that was just a great time over there!

    • Elton Bello

      Haha, g1

    • Elton Bello

      U r so lame

    • MassDeduction

      There are *so* many ways to pay less than the posted rates. Including, but not limited to:

      – get a SK/MB/QC plan and port in your BC/AB/ON/NS/NB/PEI/NF number

      – get a dual-SIM phone and get a talk&text SIM (as little as $100 per year) and a flex data SIM ($40/5GB)

      – piggy-back off of someone else’s share plan so that your rate is less than if you got your own share plan

      – check out the lesser known MVNOs like Cityfone and Public Mobile, for some use-cases they’re dramatically cheaper than their parent companies (Rogers and Telus, respectively)

      I’m just getting warmed up here. It’s so, so, so easy to pay less than the prices offered in the mall kiosks.

    • Elton Bello

      Not that easy, would be fraud. I contacted one of those carriers in the praries and they told me I have to live there. So, it has to be fraud.

    • MassDeduction

      There are multiple threads on HoFo with thousands of posts each thread, all on this topic. Reading those threads it’s clearly pretty easy. Thousands upon thousands of people have done it. You can do it without committing fraud (arguably) by doing it through Koodo’s automated system. Never done it myself, and no interest in personally doing so, but I have found it interesting reading about how people managed it.

      And by calling Sasktel or MTS you’re missing the point: the people doing this are generally doing it on Fido and Koodo, but working the system to get a plan that they normally only offer in Saskatchewan and Manitoba. There are also a few plans from Quebec that people have been working the system to get.

    • Elton Bello

      Dunno…anything that says “work the system” seems like fraud to me

    • MassDeduction

      Working the system can be fraud, or can be not fraud, depending on the situation. There’s a local grocery store here that lets you discount a single item each transaction. If you want, you can discount 1 item out of 20 in your shopping cart. If you want to go to the extra work, you can go through the line-up 20 times and pay less. Most wouldn’t go to the extra effort, but those that choose to can do so. That’s working the system, but it’s not fraud.

      Like I say, I have no personal interest in it. I’d say the process is a grey area, neither clearly fraud nor clearly not fraud. Koodo is aware of it (as evidenced by it being discussed on Koodo’s forums, and some of the posts/threads removed) yet Koodo chooses to not close the loophole.

      It’s not even that hard, from what I read on Hofo. Sign up with a (for example) Manitoba number but an Ontario plan in a store. Go home and use the automated system to switch to a Manitoba plan. Wait a week and port in your Ontario number. Is that fraud when the system does nothing to prevent you from doing so, when it could easily do so?

      There’s a whole body of thinking in business about how to get people to pay the maximum amount they’re willing to. An obvious example of this are coupons: those that can’t be bothered to clip coupons pay more, those who take the time to clip coupons pay less. I think Telus/Koodo are willing to accept the adventurous few paying less by working the system to get SK/MB plans, because a great many of those people would otherwise be on competing brands such as Rogers, Fido, Virgin, Bell, etc. Most people won’t do it because they won’t know about it, or it will seem like too much work, or they’re concerned it’s fraudulent, or they’ll be worried about it being taken away from them. But those who are determined to pay less will do so, and they’ll do so on Koodo rather than on another brand. Telus/Koodo maximize the amount they can get from most customers, but still keep the thrifty and adventurous few as customers too. I strongly believe that’s what’s happening here, and that’s primarily why I don’t think it’s fraudulent.

      But I’ll give you that it’s a grey area.

    • Elton Bello

      Cmon bro, u have a problem from the start. You cant get a manitoba number if you dont live in Manitoba. Pls check your facts right and dont post like that. I have checked. Only people who do those are those are people who are linked to fraud and sooner or later, it will catch up to you. I thought you are smarter than that.

    • MassDeduction

      You can easily get a Manitoba number if you don’t live in Manitoba. There are any number of reasons why people might want to do that. Let’s say you live in Saskatchewan, but are temporarily working in Alberta and want to keep an SK number for when you return home. Perhaps you normally live in Manitoba, but are going to school for the time being in BC. Perhaps you’re in Ontario, but are purchasing it for a family member who lives in SK/MB. All completely legit/non-fraudulent reasons. It’s trivial to get an out-of-province number on most carriers.

      Like I said, there are multiple threads on HoFo with thousands of posts each of people who have gone down to stores and got out of province numbers. They’ve been doing it for about two years now with no mass audits occurring. And I gave you a lengthy reason as to why I believe Koodo knows it’s happening yet chooses to turn a blind eye to it. *shrug*

      As for me being smarter than that, like I say, I choose not to participate. The people that have participated tend to be quiet about it, in the hopes of flying under the radar should Koodo change their mind and start auditing accounts (which would be absolutely trivial for Koodo to do; just look for lines that have SK/MB plans without SK/MB numbers, or look for lines with SK/MB plans yet no usage inside SK/MB). The fact that it would be beyond trivial for Koodo to take these SK/MB plans away from people who don’t like in SK/MB, yet chooses not to, despite the fact that who knows how many *thousands* of people are doing it (based on the volume of posts in the threads), is further proof IMO that Koodo is aware of it and is deliberately turning a blind idea to it.

    • Elton Bello

      So, I have to lie about the address and give a fake one?

    • MassDeduction

      Not at all, there’s no requirement that you live in a province to get a phone number from that province. For example, you might wish to buy a phone and pay for service for a relative that lives in another province. The billing address would be your province, but the phone number would be for their province.

      In fact, the guide on HoFo is explicit that you should *not* fake an address. Always use your legit address.
      When people do this, they get a SK/MB number, they give their non-SK/MB address and sign up on a non-SK/MB plan. Then they go to Koodo’s online self-serve portal and change to a SK/MB plan, and port in their non-SK/MB number.

      And that’s where I agree with you that it’s a grey area, as you can’t do it in store. Though I find it hard to call it fraudulent as you’ve lied about nothing, and Koodo’s online system lets you do it. *shrug*

    • Elton Bello

      I just checked it now and says residents of manitoba or sask only lol. Forget about it, too complicated for me lol

    • MassDeduction

      What does? Koodo’s policies? Fido’s? Rogers’? Bell’s? Telus’? Virgin’s? Something unrelated to policies? I’m not sure what “it” is in the above comment. 🙂

      I image you’re talking about Koodo’s policies, and if so then that supports your view that people are bending/breaking the rules to get SK/MB plans outside those provinces.

      And I believe that Telus/Koodo knows it’s happening, and is deliberately allowing it to happen as a way of stealing customers from its competitors. Which furthers my belief that it’s a grey area rather than fraud.

      So in a sense, we could both be right. 🙂

    • EllSee

      Just because you are ABLE do it doesn’t mean it’s not fraud. People just don’t feel bad about it because they are upset. It’s like saying: Someone left their car door unlocked. Now, I am ABLE to get in due to a flaw and I steal his phone. Is that theft?

    • MassDeduction

      True, but that’s not the situation here IMO. Telus/Koodo clearly know about this loophole, because it’s been posted about on Koodo’s forums and some of the posts/threads have been removed. It’s the removal that demonstrates someone at Koodo is aware of the situation, IMO. Yet they choose to not make changes to their automated system to prevent people from doing it. The process is simple, sign up with (for example) a Saskatchewan number and a BC plan. Then go to their automated system and change the plan to a Saskatchewan plan. Finally, port in your BC number over the Saskatchewan number.

      Again, never done it myself, and no interest in it (Koodo’s missing key calling features that I want). But the procedure doesn’t seem analogous to breaking into someone’s unlocked car.

    • phatmillips

      just want to say as someone who works for the company that not only must you have a Manitoba/Saskatchewan number to get a regional plan, you also need a valid address. This is a system limitation. As a rep myself I will personally check your usage to see if youre using your phone in Sask/Manitoba or in Toronto as it usually is – if you’re not using it in the correct region I cant change your plan to that area and doing so would be fraud. If that was the case I or someone else would contact BOT would audit the account which is done on a batch report regularly and fraud management might get involved with your account.
      Case in point if you must cheat the system to get a better price don’t – talk to customer relations if you’re thinking about cancelling or just go to one of the ‘smaller’ guys like Wind for a better price.

    • MassDeduction

      Hi there, thanks for the insider’s view. And I agree, half the fun is finding a way to save money without bending/breaking the rules. I’m not on an SK/MB plan.

      People get around the system limitation by signing up with a (for example), Sask number, a BC plan, and a BC address. Then Koodo’s self-serve system lets them change to a Sask plan. This has been posted on the Koodo forums and posts/threads removed by moderators so there are people at Koodo who’re aware of the practice and choose not to close the loophole. Two years and counting now that people have been successfully doing it.

      In this era of “big data”, I struggle to believe that it would be difficult for Koodo to look for people with SK/MB plans but non-SK/MB numbers and/or no usage in SK/MB. They could audit the lot of them, yet they choose not to do broad-based audits against this practice. I believe they tolerate it, as they know in most cases they’re taking business away from competitors. Their goal is to make it just hard enough (thanks in part to the watchful eye of people like you) that they avoid a flood of people doing it, but not so hard as to make it actually impossible. The way to do it is via self-serve, which helps keep the cost of customer acquisition low. I believe Telus/Koodo’s willing to have those low-margin customers on the books, so long as it’s the enterprising few and not the mainstream many. They likely have metrics on how many either signed up fresh, or ported in from other providers (as opposed to those who did it who were already on Telus/Koodo/PM) and have run the numbers and concluded it’s worth their while to have those customers at those prices. For every 20K people that do it, it’s about another million in revenue for Koodo, with exceedingly low customer acquisition and retention costs (as these people are afraid to bring any attention to their accounts). The internet takes care of most of the customer acquisition costs, and likely very few of them port out to other plans or providers.

      Your thoughts on the above?

    • KiwiBri

      The general consumer doesnt realize this is an option.

    • MassDeduction

      Really? For the last couple of years the carriers have talked about BYOD in big bold print on their websites and their mall kiosks.

    • KiwiBri

      yeah, they always just fall for the “free” phone thing if you sign up for x years. lol. I heard them complaining and mentioned how I had kept my old 6GB/$30 for years because I bought phones outright. *now* they understand.. but 2 or 3 years ago they though *I* was crazy

  • Harold Mitchell

    WOW……A delay of two whole weeks!!!

  • MrSeven

    Mobilesyrup’s original article about Rogers upcoming rate increase didn’t mention anything about Fido, also pretty sure the Bell article didn’t mention Virgin. This is the first time those 2 flanker brands have been mentioned

    • Yeah it’s also news to me that the “budget” brands would be raising prices. Looks like Virgin has gone ahead and raised it, Fido and Koodo haven’t changed their plans yet.

    • MassDeduction

      Telus announced that both Telus and Koodo would be raising rates at the same time. Like you, I hadn’t heard about Fido or Virgin before now.

  • Ricky Bobby

    Wait, so the three stooges decided to raise prices because of the economic downturn?


    If only Verizon did that to me while I was living there in 2009. Instead monthly plans kept getting lower.

    That’s Robellus for you. Seizing any opportunity to rob the customers

    • Elton Bello

      Soon to be, Sharobellus!

    • MassDeduction

      You’re right about that, I fear.

    • Elton Bello

      Sadly, I am always right because I represent the voice of the regular customers and the big three have done nothing good for the regular guy.

  • hardy83

    It’s totally understandable guys. I mean our dollar is low, so it makes sense to raise prices.
    Remember you short term memory people? When our dollar was on par with the US for around a whole year. The big 3 dropped prices of their services because of that.

    Remember! I do!
    … No wait…

    Weak dollar. Excuse to jack up prices.
    Strong dollar. Meh! People are use to the current prices and the Canadian government doesn’t care about bad business practices with the communications industry.

    • will

      As if their employees get paid in USD lol

    • alexb88

      I’m not defending Robellus, but the cost of their network components is affected since international suppliers usually charge in USD. The low dollar does have a legitimate impact to their bottom line. But under their logic, we should have seen plan prices go down when we were at par and higher.

    • hardy83

      Someone should try to use that as a rationale for getting a raise. I mean the logic is the same right?
      The dollar is weak, so wages must go up to compensate.

    • Mike Wort

      Just the semi-annual price hike again. The low dollar is just the latest excuse. Just like oil prices fall but prices at the pump drop at half the rate, but jump at the full rate the minute crude goes up again.

      Complainers are ignored and the 1% keep squeezing.
      Whatsitgonnatake Canada ? When’s enough, enuff ?

  • badger51

    The early warning saved me some money, switched over two phones on Monday

  • Patrick Canlas

    question. if you get a phone from rogers, paid it outright, and a basic plan, are you gonna be charged if you cancel your plan that same day?

    • Jason

      No, your “cancellation” fee is just paying off what you owe on the device.

    • Me Ted

      That’s not entirely true. While there aren’t any cancellation fees, you still have to pay for 90 days of service before they’ll let you walk away with an unlocked device (there’s also the unlocking fee if you decide to use them).

      There is one caveat though; Nexus devices!! They already come unlocked so all Rogers or any of the other incumbents can do is force you to go on a pay-as-you-go plan for one month and then, sayonara. In fact you can get the phone, prepay your one month, and then 2.56 seconds later, have them cancel it. From there you’re free to go anywhere you want.

      I did this exact same thing with Koodo when I bought my N5 back in 2014. Wal-Mart (I know…they’re the devil…sorry) was giving $150 in gc’s to those who bought the N5 through Koodo. I purchased the device, signed on for pay-as-you-go, went to Telus (my provider) to get a new sim, called Koodo that night to cancel and walked away happy. It made sense for me to take this route because I still have one of the old Sask 55 plans with 5gb for $55. Of course in order to keep this plan I need to buy my devices outright.

    • Patrick Canlas

      so even if its a fully paid phone, you cant terminate the plan within that day? coz im only planning to get the phone, not the plan, and some reports say that telcos force you to get one before you can buy the phone.

  • J.S.Bach

    The term subsidy is misleading, the telcos are financing your device and making pretty good money at it.

  • Markolopogous

    Can anyone explain to me why this kind of price increases doesn’t constitute price fixing? Every time one of the Big 3 increases the base price by $5, all the other carriers follow suite either the same day, or within weeks. This has happened every single time in the last 6 years. I am legitimately curious why. If McDonalds raises the cost of a Big Mac by $2 I can guarantee you won’t see Burger King raising the cost of a Whopper by the same amount. In fact Burger King would be running ads advertising that their food is cheaper–that’s the whole point of competition. To me it make absolutely no sense that Rogers wouldn’t look at Telus and be like “Hey, lets decrease our plans by $5 and advertise to everyone that its $10 a month less to have a phone with us then any other competitor.” This makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. I’m assuming that price fixing would have to involve some kind of documented proof that the companies are talking to each other or have some kind of agreement to raise prices collectively as opposed to just watching what the other guy does and raising prices every time they do just for the heck of it?

  • Ipse

    Aren’t you merciful oh mighty Robbers…..

  • deltatux

    Hope they don’t keep increasing the prices for the rest of the year but that might just be a pipe dream.